Monika: I talked with Rosalyne Blumenstein that was featured in the documentary. She described the group and herself as trailblazers. Did you feel that you witnessed something historical that will shape the future of the transgender movement?
Mariette: Yes, there were many trailblazers, many of who have been lost to history. The famous ones get the credit but they are there because of the work, sometimes just small acts, of many people. To be quite honest, I always felt that I belonged in the process of making history, and it was so meaningful to be part of a historical movement and to capture it.
Monika: Could you mention some of these forgotten individuals who have been lost to history?
Mariette: Or who will probably be lost to history, including people before my time as I only began in 1978. Here you are. Merissa Sherill Lynn, Yvonne Cook, Jake Hale, Sheila Kirk, Bridgette Bodin, Tiffany Woods, Marsha Botzer, Jude Patton, Jordy Jones, Naomi Owen, Lee’s Mardi Gras Boutique, Cheryl Chase, creator of the Intersex Society of North America, Holly Boswell, and Jenn Burleton.
There are hundreds, including many young people now. Some well-known people that you might not be familiar with: Tony Barreto-Neto, Nancy Nangeroni, Dallas Denny, Jamison Green, Susan Stryker, Riki Wilchens, Steve Dain, Mara Keisling, Zackary Drucker, Virginia Prince, Silvia Rivera, Robert Eads, Kate Bornstein, Maxwell Anderson, and Martine Rothblatt.
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| Photo by Mariette Pathy Allen. |
Monika: Well, now I am being proud of myself because I interviewed some of them!
You were also an official photographer of Fantasia Fair, a week-long conference for crossdressers, transgender, and gender-questioning people held every October in Massachusetts, founded in 1975 by individuals such as Betsy Shaw, Ari Kane, Betty Ann Lind, and Linda Franklin, as well as other members of The Cherrystones, a transgender support group based out of Boston. Which conferences stand out in your memory?
Mariette: Linda Franklin wasn’t part of this group. “Fantasia Fair” is an annual event that takes place in Provincetown, MA. Ariadne Kane was a brilliant, innovative person who came up with most of the events at the Fair. 1980 was the first time I went to a conference. After that, I went there almost every year until around 2018.
Merissa Sherill Lynn was another important person. She was the president of the Cheerystone Club, and the founder of the “Transgender Tapestry” and IFGE: The International Foundation for Gender Education” a very important organization.
Merissa was a philosopher by nature and a very generous person who helped anyone who needed help or even a place to stay. I also went to many conferences: “Southern,” IFGE, “Be-All” (Be All You Want to Be), TRI-Ess, (for heterosexual crossdressers),” and many more. Too many to mention here.
Monika: The Southern Comfort Conference is a major transgender conference that has taken place annually since 1991. What was the most interesting aspect of this event from your point of view as a photographer?
Mariette: “Southern Comfort” no longer exists. Very many of the conferences are gone now. Once the Internet became a major source of information and friendship, the conferences weren’t needed as much. They also became boring and predictable. I remember one of the last SoCos I attended, most of the seminars were about surgery. If six or seven surgeons come to a conference, they each take up two sessions, one on FTM and the other, on MTF. This has happened gradually over time.
Earlier, it was the largest TG conference, attended by a great variety of people, including many locals for whom it was affordable. You could meet so many different people, go to or lead a variety of seminars, dance at night There was a group of people who came for excitement and sexual activity. That added a bit of mystery to the conference!
Monika: You also had a chance to meet Virginia Prince, an American transgender activist, publisher of Transvestia magazine, and founder of the Foundation for Personality Expression (FPE) and later the Society for the Second Self for male heterosexual cross-dressers. She must have been a charismatic person.
Mariette: She was brilliant! Her contributions were vitally important. She was the person who clarified the differences between anatomical sex, gender identity, and gender expression. She was very opinionated and could argue for hours on certain topics. Some people disliked her thoroughly and felt she was wrong and old-fashioned in certain ways. I appreciated her and enjoyed photographing her as well as just being with her.
Monika: I guess you did a lot of beauty pageants. Some activists criticize the concept of transgender beauty pageants, pointing out that they lead to an obsession with youth and female beauty. Some arguments might be justifiable but for many girls, it is a question of self-acceptance and celebration of the long and winding road to womanhood.
Mariette: I didn’t go to any beauty pageants!!! “Fantasia Fair” and many of the other conferences included “fashion shows” or an opportunity to come up with an act to perform. Those events weren’t beauty contests though.
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| Photo by Mariette Pathy Allen. Local entertainer in Provincetown, MA, 1991. |
Mariette: I love dressing rooms! There’s so much spontaneity and all sorts of people practically tripping over each other. There are lots of mirrors so one can see the person putting on make-up but also what is happening around them. By the time they leave the dressing room, the spontaneity is over and the image they project is “perfect”.
Monika: Let’s leave the USA for a moment and focus on your international projects. In TransCuba (2014), you present the transgender community of Cuba, especially its growing visibility and acceptance in a country whose government is transitioning into a more relaxed model of communism under Raúl Castro's presidency. Again you record a cultural watershed but this time not in the USA but within Cuba. You knew the process in the USA well. Did it look different in Cuba?
Mariette: Sadly, the USA and its relationship to Cuba has gone backwards since Trump. The transwomen in Cuba are starving and the whole country is suffering. Regarding the acceptance of transgender people, I think Cuba started off even worse than the USA, but the trajectory is similar.
Monika: It was historical when President Obama used the word “transgender” in a speech. Then the pendulum swung in a totally different direction under President Trump and changed back under President Biden. So politically the transgender community is not in a stable situation yet. It all depends on who is in power. You have witnessed all those political changes. Do you think this unstable situation will prevail?
Mariette: I don’t know what will happen. It’s very scary. Politicians are trying to pass many bills that will hurt people, especially trans youth and even their parents. Within the last few days, a Republican from Florida stated that transgender people shouldn’t exist, period. Biden can’t stop the current wave of cruelty and violence. Trump brought out and encouraged the worst in people. Fascism seems to be rearing its ugly head in many parts of the world.
Monika: The book includes a contribution from Raúl Castro's daughter, Mariela Castro, the director of the Cuban National Center for Sex Education in Havana. In 2005, she proposed a project, which became law three years later, to allow transgender individuals to receive sex reassignment surgery and change their legal gender. Did you meet her in person? The whole cultural change would have not been possible without her support, I guess.
Mariette: The reason I was drawn to Cuba was that I read an article about her in the New York Times, and I was full of admiration for her. I belong to WPATH (World Professional Association for Transgender Health). In 2012 Mariela invited certain members of the group to a conference about sex. Although I wasn’t invited, I went along with that group and stayed after the conference. I spent a lot of time with her in the company of others. We weren’t in a one-on-one situation as she didn’t speak English and I didn’t speak Spanish.
Monika: Three years after TranCuba, you published "Transcendents: Spirit Mediums in Burma and Thailand" (2017). Why did you decide to focus on these two countries?
Mariette: I knew Professor Eli Coleman who was the head of the Department of Human Sexuality at the Medical School at the University of Minnesota as well as the President of WPATH. He studied the areas in the world where gender-variant people were important members of their cultures. He had been to Burma and Thailand many times and we decided to collaborate on a book.
Monika: Thailand is known for being one of the most friendly countries for transgender women but Burma is rather unknown in this respect.
Mariette: What we’re referring to here are Spirit Mediums. They are honored and respected because they are the catalysts through which messages from the Spirits are conveyed. This animistic tradition existed before Buddhism. Usually in the past, the Mediums were women, but over time they could be men (mostly gay) and transgender people. They are in no way related to “Lady Boys” who tend to be entertainers and sex workers.
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| Photo by Mariette Pathy Allen, Paula, with her daughter, Rachel. Philadelphia, PA, 1987. |
Monika: Are you working on any new publications?
Mariette: Yes. I will make a book about Vicky West, the person who introduced me to the trans community. As Dirk, he was a book designer for a prestigious book publisher, and as Vicky, she designed the covers for “Drag” magazine and other work for transgender publications. She was a successful artist both ways. I also plan a retrospective book of my work.
Monika: Is there anyone or anything that you have always wanted to photograph but you have not managed to do yet?
Mariette: At the moment, I can’t think of anything. I just want to keep working.
Monika: Mariette, I would like to thank you for all these years of being an ally of our transgender community. You have witnessed our fascinating fight for our rights, and your photos will always be with us to prove that we have always been right about not giving up.
Mariette: Thank you Monika, for giving me this opportunity to share my experience. Your interview is thorough and generous!
END OF PART 2
All the photos: courtesy of Mariette Pathy Allen.
Mariette Pathy Allen's website: mariettepathyallen.com
© 2023 - Monika Kowalska
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